[AngL]

Hi,

I have never posted before but have been doing a lot of reading. We are interested in adopting a 4-6 yr old son but after reading many of the post I am very concerned about the problems these children may have. I know I sound selfish (mostly scared) but I do have a 7 yr old bio son and as some members in other post have expressed I do not want something such as a bad adoption to hurt my marriage or most of all my son. We would love to have another little boy (I can't have anymore to adoption is our only choice) and my son would be a great big brother but after everything I have read I am very concerned. Is this normal or it adoption not for us? Any insight would be greatly appreciated.

[Boulderbabe]

So much depends on the kid and what has happened to him.

All older kids available for adoption will have some issues. At bare minimum, they've had a lot of losses. Some kids are resilient, and recover beautifully. They go on to do really well in school and in life. Other kids are less resilient, or they've experienced a lot more trauma. Some of them probably can't heal completely.

One suggestion I have is to wait to be matched with a child, rather than selecting a child from photolistings. The kids on the photolistings have been in the system longer, and have probably (but not always) had more placements and more loss. Many of them are being photolisted because their disabilities make them hard to place.

If you take a child as a fost/adopt placement who has just come into the system, they will have experienced abuse and neglect. But they won't have had the multiple losses and traumas that drifting from foster home to foster home causes. You're taking a bigger risk--the kid may go home or go to relatives--but the child is more likely to be able to recover emotionally without the damage from years of foster drift.

Good luck. It's wonderful that you're being realistic and going into this with your eyes open! No, you're not likely to have a fairytale. But you should also know that the real nightmares are the exception rather than the rule.

[Linny]

I agree with the previous poster for the most part. The reasons/advice to wait for a match, rather than check with photolistings is a good one.
Our personal experiences though, wouldn't indicate 'that real nightmares are the exception, rather than the rule here'. I would tell you that statistically, the older the child is at placement, the higher the risk for disruption. That's not a comforting thing to consider, I realize---but it's true.

It IS good you're thinking well about this before pursuing the placement of a child. You're not being selfish here at all....you're being realistic and protective of the child you already have. That's being a good parent, period. You have to consider that most older adopted children have been sexually abused (the percentage we were given was close to 97% ); many of them have also been physically and neglectfully abused as well. I would tell you that the neglect is the hardest one to deal with (and I didn't use to believe that).....but when you have other children in the home, the sexual abuse and possible sexual acting out, can be just as difficult to deal with.
I'm not trying to scare you. I think I'm being realistic. In the eight children we adopted...five have been infants. Three were older----two separate adoption experiences. They were 3yrs, 6yrs and 7yrs when they arrived. All of the older children have failed in some form. All but one older child did damage to our other children in some way.

Having a seven year old son at home now, would lead me to suggest you might consider adopting a much younger child in your pursuit. By this, I'd suggest a child no older than five years old; and even then, realize even a child of that age will have some issues...though the rule goes that the younger the child, the more time you have to help overcome any issues.

Parenting these children is often not fun....is often very tough.......and can be very rewarding and wonderful. But, knowing the risks, options and exactly what you're comfortable with, is the most important of all.

Sincerely,

Linny

[mrsred]

They are right, a lot depends on the child you are adoptingg. A lot also depends onyour biological son.
some kids are able to accept and deal with the issues that come with an older adopted child, some are not.
We have been very blessed. Our first adotpion was a boy 3 1/2 years younger than our biological son. That was a good age difference. They were (and still are) close enough in age to play together, but J is definately the Big Brother. Also, since E had a lot of rage issues the age difference helped protect J from serious injuries when E would strike out. Something to think about there. A lot of these kids come from a background of domestic violence. If they weren't getting abused themselves, they were witnessing dad beat up mom. Also, nobody has ever taught them how to deal with their anger. They get mad, they attack. Your biological child has to be enough older and bigger that he can defend himself.
But all that being said, adopting an "older child" can work. It isn't easy, it isn't a fairy tale.... no well adjusted mice like Stuart Little out there. These kids come with a lot of baggage. But if you are resilient enough, if your biological son is secure enough it can be a life enriching experience.
Three years ago J was 8 1/2 and an only child. He is now the proud big brother to two sisters (11 and 4) and one brother (8). I asked him recently if he had any regrets. He said "No, Mom. I wasn't just an only child, I was a lonely child." At the end of fifth grade they had every child in class write something nice about every other child on slips of paper. At the end of the week each child got to bring home 25 unsigned compliments. J's were pretty consistant.... they mentioned how smart he is, and then mentioned how kind, considerate and compassionate he is. I don't know if he is that way because he has had to cope with three difficult younger sibs, or he has been able to cope with three difficult sibs because he is that way!

[joskids]

I agree with the above posters. The resilience factor is huge. I strongly believe that each of us has a varied capacity for resilience in our lives and it strongly relates to how well we do with the experiences that life brings to us. If you have a 7 year old and he is your only child, I suspect he is the light of your lives and you would like to feel that way about your second child. In that regard, I would think a child under the age of 2 would be better suited to your family. If you have no experience with foster children, hurt children, abused children, bringing such a child into your current family could be overwhelming. I've always wanted to adopt older children but we have seen how that did not work for our family. Of our 4 adopted children, 3 were infants when they came and one had just turned 2 years old. Even at that age, we definitely see that she has had to work harder to feel like a part of this family. We adore and love her, but it was very different with a 2 year old who had experienced much grief and loss than to bring an infant into the family. I've also done foster care and had a 4 year old who did beautifully in our home where her 1 year old brother had many issues, so it really depends on the child. They are both doing very well in their adoptive family as the family has really done all they could to promote the bonding with the children. I do think you may be able to adopt a young child that is not on the photolistings if you make calls to various workers about other children you see on the photolisting and ask if they have other children on their caseload who are becoming available for adoption who may not have experienced as many moves. The more moves a child has at a young age, the harder it will be for them to bond to your family.

[Mama Julie]

I was getting along well with the 2 girls that were going to be placed with us (age 9 & 10)... but my kids didn't always like them, and my husband was having a hard time with them too; so we had to call off the placement. Find a child who is not aggressive... it's hard for your child to have to all of a sudden try to defend himself against new siblings who are aggressive. Special needs kids are often manipulative. Can you and/or your partner deal with this without showing your frustration? that was the problem my husband was having.... he wasn't able to control his frustration when the girls wouldn't listen to him; he would start yelling and then the girls would think it was funny, which of course mad my husband more mad. These kids need calm parents but very firm parents. In my experience, they need "tough love"; you can't be a pansy and worry about if you're hurting their feelings... they need to see that you are the one in charge. I was just watching the movie Stomp the Yard and I'm talking about the scene when DJs uncle tells him to get his black ungrateful a$$ into the car... after DJs brother was murdered, the uncle makes DJ go to college... he tells him the rules up front & doesn't feel sorry for him even though he's just lost his brother. That's how it is; you feel sorry for these poor kids who've lost so much, but you have to be firm with them in order for them not to walk all over you and your family. Julie

[AngL]

Thank you for the input. My son can be sensitive but for the most part is able to hold his own when things happen at school but he is not the least bit aggressive. He did not even strike back at his 3 yr old cousin when he punched him. He would love to have a brother and we would love to have another boy. From what I understand in the previous posts, the best thing would be to look for a 2-4 yr old with as few moves as possible and without aggression. Is it possible to find that? I really do not want an infant. I have done that and do not really want to do it again. I have seen some scary things about some children on other posts. Is it like that will all older adopted children? I apologize for sounding naive but I really want to know exactly what to expect before I pursue adoption and am trying to collect as much information as possible.

[Linny]

Only God knows if you'll find a child of that age, who has not been moved a lot and isn't aggressive.

Here's what you can expect, as far as I'm concerned:

1. The child will more than likely (though, NOT always) be 'smarter' to the world (streetwise in many respects) than a child who's the same age that hasn't done the foster route.

2. The system will SELDOM give you ALL of the details of this child...and more than likely, will 'smooth' over any that might be seen as more difficult to deal with.

3. This child will more than likely have some issues in attachment. Best to read up on this and have a therapist in the wings, in case this is a big issue. Attachment issues vary greatly.........

4. Help yourself out, by---not only reading---but attending (more than once) a support group of parents who've already adopted older children. Most of us are more than willing to speak to hopeful couples and give pointers, KWIM?

5. Many couples find that bringing in a child who's older doesn't feel the same as having an infant (or a bio child). Many don't feel this way. Good idea to explore this in your hearts; and be prepared for times when your feelings may be stepped on.

6. Specifically write out and discuss in length, what your family can deal with. Read and discuss these with parents who've already BTDT with their older children. Keep this list handy; and stick with it (within reason). There may be times when you'll be quick to accept a placement from the very onset; but best to be hesitant to accept UNTIL you've had time to ponder and sleep on it, KWIM? (Some agencies are awful about this with couples......)

7. IF and WHEN you accept a placement.......consider this first and foremost:

"Can I accept this child and his issues as they are NOW...as if they'll NEVER improve. There are children who don't heal, who don't get better with permanance. IF you can deal with and accept this child as he is---NOW-------this is WAY ahead of the game.

If you can't deal with the child---NOW---as he stands---with no improvement.....consider NOT accepting the placement, or continuing with it.

I could think of more, including my own list of questions to ask about any older child placement, before the child comes to your home.....but I'll leave this as it is for now.
If you'd like to have my own list of questions to ask (I'm told it's good.... )...please feel free to pm me and I'll gladly send it to you.

My best to you....

Sincerely,

Linny

[sassafras]

We added a sib set of two girls and one boy ages 11, 10 and 7 when we got them. We had a bio son who was 7 at the time. He LOVES his siblings and was so excited when we adopted them. It really has been a wonderful experience for everyone involved.

[skyeanjel]

I plan to adopt a 12.5 year old girl my daughter met at the bus stop who was heartbroken that her foster family was going to adopt her 5 year old sister and not her. My daughter would come home and tell me about this little girl crying at the bus stop and that her foster family was sending her "back". They did and my kids helped her clean out her locker and watched her leave when CPS came to pick her up. She was gone about a week before I decided to call her caseworker and tell her I wanted to straight Adopt this little girl. I have been waiting for the adoption application and I get upset every day it is not in mail. I think she just wants a family and she is about the same age as my kids, son 16, son 12, and daughter 11. I am not going to do a "trial" foster as I know once I have her, I wouldn't have the heart to send her back. I will have to deal with her problems like Iwould my own children if they had problems.

[jackiesbooks]

Just know Skyeanjel that her issues will probably not be anything like your children. I had 2 boys and the behaviors that my youngest had when he was placed I had never even dreamed of.

Read up on attachment issues. RAD children are VERY charming.

[joskids]

skyeangel, pls proceed with caution. Be careful not to downplay the foster parents and assume they did something "wrong" or didn't care about this girl or are yet another set of "horrible foster parents" that are letting her go because of their own issues. Your heart is a caring one but the children you have at home are your priority. Bringing a hurt child into your home can cause problems that you cannot even begin to imagine. It's easy to toss aside what others on this thread are saying about older child adoption. It's easy to think that this child "just needs love" and that with your love she will be fine. Please get involved with a group of families that have adopted older children and do not believe all that an agency will tell you about a child. Agencies tend to blame foster parents and, not having been foster parents themselves, caseworkers tend to gloss over issues that they personally don't believe exist in a child. There ARE successful older child adoptions, yet there are many older children that I have personally seen try to destroy those around them. It is asking too much of some children to expect them to become part of an already established family. We need to be fair to them also by not asking the impossible.

[WLD]

i wasn't going to comment because quite frankly i don't know how applicable my situation would be. My son was 5 when we adopted him BUT he had not been in the foster system. we adopted him from acquaintences. We adopted him for what some would think are the wrong reasons. Not because we wanted to add to our family but because we thought he had went through enough and couldn't bear the thought of him going into the foster system. Now 2 1/2 years later, i find myself forgetting sometimes that he is adopted. he will even say something about having his older sister and dad's eyes. he knows he is adopted but we just forget sometimes because he fits in so nicely with our family. Mine is a success story but it was definitely not easy in the beginning and to be perfectly honest there were a few times when i thought, 'what have we done?' it took a lot of persistence and a lot of love and it wasn't easy on him or my daughter and definitely not on my and my husband. But i can't imagine my life and family without him now. I guess my advice would be similar to others and that is think it all out and even imagine some of the bad scenarios and be brutally honest with yourself as to what you can and can't deal with. If someone had told me what i would be dealing with in the beginning, i'm not so sure that i would have went through with it. But now that i am on this side of it, i'm glad we did.

[skyeanjel]

I appreciate all the warnings and I do understand the issues because I was a foster child and so was my husband. I do not blame the foster parents and I certainly don't believe everything the caseworker says. I will say that sometimes it is a matter of putting the right child in the right home with parents who can deal with the needs of that paticular child. If you have never had a teen then taking in a teen and then one with problems would be very difficult. I also remember what it feels like to be the outsider because foster parents tend to remind you all the time that you are temporary. There are even some that do it for the money, even though I know theres not alot in it.I am in no way downplaying that some children can be very difficult ( I know friends who have bio children that are nightmares) but I think they deserve a chance. I am a little dissappointed in this forum in that I have read over and over again about how bad these children can be and it turns people off who would like to adopt, therefore leaving these children again without a home. Caution is good, research is good, but telling people these kids are more likely going to cause you problems then joy is not good. I am a foster child who is going to take a class on how to care for abused and neglected children and I will bet I could teach that class.
FYI constant therapy and reminding kids of all the bad things that happened to them so they can relive it over and over again is useless and allows the child to have a reason to blame every bad action they take afterwards.Putting children on drugs such as ritalin is horrible and then you are dealing wigth the drug instead of the child. Very few kids need these kind of drugs.
I am married for 14 years with 3 children that have never been on any kind of drugs and do well in school.
My children have never been in any trouble. I am a realtor in my area and a former licensed home daycare provider and have done very well. I am happy because I chose to be happy. I tell my kids (as I will my new child) that the choice is yours.You are responsible for your actions but I will do my best to create happy memories for you.
I am sorry if you all disagree with me but I wanted to post how I feel so you can see it from a foster child view rather then what the latest therapist says.

[LisArno]

Skyeanjel - Congratulations on your decision to adopt the girl! Just over a year ago, my husband and I adopted three children (internationally) who were 10, 4, and 3 at that time. They had been in a neglectful home, and then in foster care (oldest) and orphanage (younger two) for a year. They are wonderful!!!! The only "problem" we have with our now 11 year old is that she is a pre-teen and is somewhat bossy at times, but much less so than most girls that age. We've had no issues with our youngest two.

With that said, just make sure your other children know that it might not be easy at times. When I was 11 and my sister was 13, my parents adopted a boy who was nine. We thought it would be great to have a brother and had no idea what to expect other than, "He likes baseball just like you do". He had been abused in every way possible, and my sister and I were not prepared for what he would do or say. We really didn't know he'd be a lot different than us! Retrospecitively, we should have been told what to expect and how to handle various situations. He caused lots of problems for my parents for many, many years, and finally truly "settled down" when he was around 33-35.