[Missy M]

I have an innocent questin that I hope doesn't offend anyone:
So many times especially in the media and entertainment world I see people of mixed race / color referred to simply as Black or African American instead of bi-racial. Does anyone see the logic in this? How does everyone feel about this, it matters to me, but is it only me??? Please answer....Missy M

[spaypets]

But I should note that I'm caucasian, so I am really only answering based on what I've read and what I've been told. I apologize in advance if my words seem inappropriate.

First off, most AA people have some white ancestors.

Years ago, people considered anyone who was, I believe 1/16th Negro (the term used then) to be black, regardless of how they looked. Of course, there were people who "passed" for white and left their families behind, but many others lived in the AA community. Because there was such separation of the races, they had to choose how they were going to identify themselves because it dictated where they would go to school, where they would work and whom they would marry.

Moving forward to today, while we would all like to believe that people are judged by the content of the character, the sad fact is that they are more often judged by the color of their skin. If people treat you a certain way because you look AA, it doesn't matter if one or both of your parents are white, you are being placed in a category and you are likely to come to identify with that category.

A young man with one black parent and one white parent, who has AA features is more likely to get followed in a mall, stopped for driving a nice car, questioned when he's helping a friend move, etc., etc. than his blond blue-eyed brother. Is it any wonder that he would identify with the group that outsiders identify him with?

As the mother of a daughter born in India, I'm accutely aware that as my daughter grows, people aren't going to know that she has two fair skinned parents. I need to give her the tools to deal with the bigotry that brown skinned people in this country face.

Missy, I undrstand your quesion but don't have an answer

But I have another question for you.....Why does everyone call all people with black skin AA....when in fact they may be haitian american, jamician american, ect. ?

[Missy M]

Originally posted by dpen6
Missy, I undrstand your quesion but don't have an answer

But I have another question for you.....Why does everyone call all people with black skin AA....when in fact they may be haitian american, jamician american, ect. ?

Thanks to both of you for attempting to answer; I guess I should have been clearer with my question but I got a delivery call while I posted it and had to run....(I run / own a birthing center and we delivered 7 babies today including a set of twins.) Lets see if I can make myself clear. I understand the slavery angle and I know thats what it was about long ago, but my question is based on a more recent assessment.
BTW: I am an AA female married to a Cc male and together we have 3 adult kids. IMO my kids are biracial (of 2 races.) The actress Halle Berry when given the academy award accepted as a *Black* woman on behalf of Black women everywhere. Since her Mom is Cc and her dad AA I think she is biracial.... the media hearlds her as AA and to me it does a disservice to AA women, not to mention her mother... Her hair is not my hair, her lips are not my lips. I also think that if she'd decided to accept that award on behalf of "white women all over the nation" the outcry would have drowned out the laughter. Therein lies my question, what would be said if she decides to identify herself as white since she is as much white as she is black? Why is AA the "catch-all"? Anything less than obvious white becomes black.
My kids were never considered AA or Cc. Mom is AA, Dad is Cc; they are a wonderful uniquely blended combination of both of us. In the state of Texas the race of the kids is based on the race of the father! That means that despite being the color of Oprah I walked into preschool and enrolled these kids with birth certificates proclaiming them as Cc! Go figure.
To dpen6: usually we (AA)'s don't classify everyone as AA; WE make the distinction. In conversation you'll often hear "that Jamaican guy that lives near the park" etc. No one would ever think my daughters are only "black", and AA's wouldn't describe them as such. My oldest is a green eyed blonde, the 2nd daughter is a hazel eyed brunette, and our son is Bruce Willis bald by choice with brown eyes...they are constantly asked what they are "mixed with."
Just thought I'd ask since I heard Jay Leno introduce both Halle and Lisa Bonet as AA.....Missy M

You missy,

It really does not make sense how we as a society classify people. Could it be because America is a land of immigrants and most of us all have ancestors from another country? I don't know, to deep for this little brain.

I guess its time for our demograghers to come up with more classifacations for their paperwork. A child that is half black and half caus. is just that, biracial, not one more then the other. unless of course you had Cc imprints way back or your husband had AA.......wow this COULD get complicated!

Do your children ask why they are considered Cc?

As an adoptee ....I was brought up italion, but really have irish,english and don't know what else. Don't look like any of those nationalities...hmmmm....

[Missy M]

Well heck dpen6, maybe you are AA too...LOL! My kids asked "why" years ago and were told what the hospital social worker told us at the births; just as the dads last name is put in place as the kids last name, so is his race! We fought to have them listed as biracial but were told our only option was to check "other" on the form because there wasn't a biracial box to check. Heck, we thought checking "other" should be reserved for aliens from other planets, so we didn't. My son was once denied a job because he refused to list himself as a member of a minority on the application; it seems they need to hire some. In his words to do so would negate his dads role in his life. By the same token(pun intended) he had his 1st baby 5 weeks ago and despite her mom being the color of this font the baby's race is listed as yep...you got it Cc, because her father who isn't is also listed as Cc. My grand daughter is similar to Halle Berry in color but unlike Halle she is Cc....according to the state of Texas....LOL I guess in Texas they really DON'T see color.....Missy M

[spaypets]

LOL, Missy, boy is my face red. I realized that I answered your question assuming you were caucasian -- I hope I didn't sound as foolish as I feel -- me, a white chick, explaining slavery -- jeeze!

Anyway, I'm cracking up about the state of Texas deciding to list a baby's race based on the race of the father despite the fact that the child might look nothing like that race.

My daughter was born in India and is the color of chocolate -- certainly as dark as many AA people. We have a bit of trouble filling out forms. Technically she's caucasian if you are considering the three big racial categories (Caucasianoid, Mongoloid and Negroid), but she's not "white." These days racial categories have been merged into ethnic categories but South Asian isn't usually listed and just simply putting Asian seems misleading since people assume that means from countries like China or Korea.

I have gotten to the point where I think that racial categories are really silly and if you want to describe people you should describe them as individuals.

When we filled out the paperwork to finalize our adoption the form asked for our ethnicity -- I got irritated since on my mother's side all my greatgrandparents were born in the US and said "American." I mean how far back was I supposed to go?

[allabouthorses]

I am 1/2 Jamaican, 1/4 Cree Indian, 1/8 Lebanese, and 1/8 Scottish. I have been referred to as being "Black" by peers all my life. It bothers me for 2 reasons.

1) Saying that I am "black" denies all my other ethnicities. I have what some people call a "native heart", meaning that I identify with my native heritage. When I do my hair in 2 pig tails, I think I look pretty "indian". I have always loved Native art and music, and feel very "at home" when I'm at a pow wow. While I haven't explored my Jamaican or Lebanese heritage as much, they are still a part of me, and I value them. I only found out that I was part Scottish in 2002, when I was reunited with my birth mother. I was surprised, but it made sense. Like Native music, I have always loved the bagpipes. I have always wanted to learn how to highland dance. Finding out that I had Scottish blood explained that for me.

2) Most of my peers consider that "black" is synonymous with "cool". Silly, but very much an accepted "fact". It's just another type of racism. No real negative connotations, but it's stereotyping that I don't like. People assume that I will act, speak, sing, and dance a certain way because I have darker skin. It's ridiculous! When people refer to me as "black" I simply say, "I'm not 'black', I'm me." or I explain that I am multiracial.

I think that people do this because it's easier than saying "so, what race are you?" before they make a reference to the person's ethnicity.

I think that people say "African American" because that's what they hear the most. People are so concerned with being politically correct, that they just use whatever term they hear AA people use. You usually can't tell if someone's Jamaican, Haitian, African, etc. by looking at them, so it's difficult to make the distinction in your speech.

Just MHO...

[redhedded]

My amazing deceased grandfather who was half Irish and half Potawatomi was an obsessive crossworder. He worked and completed 3-4 everyday of his life, including the NY Times and LA Times. My entire life he would discuss a person or event then make mention of their last name, including the latin meaning and more recent country of origin. He would always ask me when I discussed my friends whether their "appearance" was consistent with their surname and it's origin. He experienced his fair share of racism; it is certain that an Irish woman marrying a Native American in 1900 was not an acceptable choice in small town America. He attended only Indian school until college and saw only a "medicine man" until shortly before his death. His inquiries were not malicious but rather the result of his interest in language and genealogy. I often categorize myself as Irish, not because I do not identify with my Native American, German and French roots but because it is most time effective and because I most physically identify with the Irish traits and experience.

Spay, you can certainly categorize your daughter (and she when older) however you choose when required. While some Americans may think of Chinese or Korean in reference to Asian, most Asians believe that Indians are the "purest" Asian race; because of the caste system, there was, of course, little inter-marrying. Most Chinese, Laotian, Burmese, Vietnamese and Thai are a combination of many ethnicities. Buddhism was a later philosophical and religious theology based in Hinduism. My Southeast Asian husband and my Indian BIL (as do all of their family when needed) fully identify and categorize themselves as Asian.

As one who was brought up without knowing my heritage, I find this discussion very interesting.

Missy...ya never know ..I may be AA...wouldn't that be cool. Last year I thought I found my bfather...he had native american blood...I thought how cool is that!! I looked for the high cheek bones...maybe some exotic features...nope...just plain ole me...The DNA was negative anyway!!

You know...non adoptive people don't seem to be as interested!

[spaypets]

I didn't know what Indian people put down. When we registered her at the hospital, we said Asian, but I've put Caucasian down too (though she has a Mongoloid spot -- the birthmark that many AA people and Asian people have at the base of her spine).

[Sharon]

"I didn't know what Indian people put down. When we registered her at the hospital, we said Asian, but I've put Caucasian down too (though she has a Mongoloid spot -- the birthmark that many AA people and Asian people have at the base of her spine)." ~Spaypets

If you want to get really scientific about it, it is my understanding that there are three races; Caucasoid, Negroid, and Mongoloid (Asiatic).
People of India, people of Hispanic descent, as well as people of the middle eastern countries all fall under the category "Caucasoid", in other words, caucasian; white.
American Indians fall under the category "Asiatic" or Mongoloid, as they are the descendants of Asians who came across the Bering Strait to America thousands of years ago.
Why race is even relevant in this day and age is another question entirely ... don't get me started...
~ Sharon

I wish race was not relevant. I know I am looking at it as a heritage thing. Race and ethnicty kinda go together. In those three catgories are so many different heritages and cultures. I find that so interesting. Of course quite a few of preconcieved ideas are sterotypical and don't apply to everyone in that particular group. The problem is when people buy into the negative of those sterotypes and base personal opinions abiyt people on that. Now thats dumb!!

Donna

[redhedded]

thought this might be of interest to you.

http://www.project-impact.org/iapac/...storyideas.pdf

[bellazmama]

I told some of my Black friends about the Texas policy and they cracked up! I mean, the children way on down the line could be, like, 1/16 White and still be listed as White on their birth certificates!

Bella is 1/2 Black, 1/4 Polish, 1/8 Italian, and 1/8 German. She has quite the temper and personality, let me tell you! We know nothing about her birth father other than his "check this box" race, so he could be mixed with other races, too, but we just don't know. Her birth mother is White.

I also agree that classifying women like halle Berry as "Black" is a disservice to Black women everywhere. That's like saying all White women should look like Barbie. Sheesh!

As for the whole AA thing, I agree that "Black" is a much more realistic term. I mean, I don't go around calling myself a "European-American." I'm White. Since the civil rights movement began, it has always been the intellectual Left who determines what Black individuals are called. It has evolved so much over the past fifty years, no wonder we're all so confused. I totally realize that Black people in this coiuntry have been searching for an identity and that's why the terms have changed, but most of my Black friends far prefer "Black" and "Mixed." So, I tend to go with what they are comfortable with. What will Bella call herself? That will be her choice. I can only provide her with support and the knowledge that she is an individual made up of many parts.

Bella will be seen by society at large as Black. I know that. But as long as I acknowledge and instruct her on the other parts of her heritage, it'll be all right. I even gave her an African middle name so that should she choose to explore her "Blackness" once she gets older, she'll know that Mommy loved her enough to acknowledge her heritage.

Sorry to ramble, but this is a topic I've thought a lot about.

Sarah