[snuffie]

Hi,
I missed a news story on one of the local news channels but was told about it by someone else.
She said that there is a movement in wisconsin to permanently seal adoption records. They are already sealed but this would be a permanent, non reversible seal. From what she said some birth parents who are upset at having been found have started this movement and are trying to get a bill passed.

I hope that this is just a "rumor". Has anyone heard of this?

[Nicole28]

That frustrates me.

Here's what I say - if you relinquish a child for adoption, that does not mean this child forfeits their rights to know where they came from or access their medical records.

I feel like it's an abomination to relinquish a child and then expect that that child will never want to search. Seriously - it's so unfair.

ACK I can't even write a reply to this post because I'm so frustrated. If that bill passes, it will break my heart. I just don't understand the logic.

[jeanette reno]

hmmm, when I looked for my parents in wi, the state wouldn't tell me anything about them until they both gave there permission. I think that's a pretty fair way to do it I don't see how permanently sealing records is very fair to those who want to look and be found. And how would they have been found through the records by thier bchildren, w/o giving permission first, from what I was told that was the only way I could be told who they were.

[rainbowfromgod]

I am an adoptee as well as a birth mother. I would love to connect with my son. However, although I know quite a bit about my birth mother, as far as she is concerned I do not exist so I have not bothered her. As you can see there are several sides. I think if the birth parents give permission all records should be opened. I don't think my birth mother would agree though.

[dpen6]

Originally Posted by rainbowfromgod

I am an adoptee as well as a birth mother. I would love to connect with my son. However, although I know quite a bit about my birth mother, as far as she is concerned I do not exist so I have not bothered her. As you can see there are several sides. I think if the birth parents give permission all records should be opened. I don't think my birth mother would agree though.

The only issue I have with that is that those records contain info that pertains to the adoptee and I feel the adoptee should have total acess to them all. What neither the birthparents or the adoptee have is a total right to contact. If one or the other doesnt want contact that needs to be respected. BUT the records, names and info in those records should be totally open for the adopted person to have.

[rainbowfromgod]

The birth information like the date, time, and location should be available to an adoptee. Any problems involved with the pregnancy or birth should also be available. This information would certainly help not only with one's identity, but with any potential health risks. I know many birth parents were almost forced to give any rights away during the adoption proceedure. However, there are those birth parents who do not want any contact. Making the names of birth parents available could potentially cause problems. I chose to put a statement in my son's adoption papers that if he wanted to contact me, please contact me be mail or phone not just show up at my door. The reason for this was to protect my future family. My children know about their brother, but they deserve the right to chose whether they want to meet him. I would definitely want to meet him though.

[dpen6]

Originally Posted by rainbowfromgod

The birth information like the date, time, and location should be available to an adoptee. Any problems involved with the pregnancy or birth should also be available. This information would certainly help not only with one's identity, but with any potential health risks. I know many birth parents were almost forced to give any rights away during the adoption proceedure. However, there are those birth parents who do not want any contact. Making the names of birth parents available could potentially cause problems. I chose to put a statement in my son's adoption papers that if he wanted to contact me, please contact me be mail or phone not just show up at my door. The reason for this was to protect my future family. My children know about their brother, but they deserve the right to chose whether they want to meet him. I would definitely want to meet him though.

Protect your other chidren from WHAT!!! From the other human being you gave birth to? Give time location ect BUT NOT the given name a person was born with? WHY??? To protect the rest of the world? Given the names of the birth parents is actualy given the name of the person born. But because of decsions made for that vunerable human being at the time of birth the burden is on the adoptee not to know who they are in the most basic way possible, is the norm. As an adoptee, my children(I have 5), have a right to know what those names , a right to know there geneolical, medical history. It has gone beyond just me here because of my children and furture grandchildren. Sorry, in my opinion MY children rights come before your raised, children rights......your raised children have their most basic info to pass alonf to their children...I didn't.

So you see...I want names...it is mine as well as your raised children heritage. Unless you really feel that the one "given away" matters less then your raised....hmmmm

I am NOT talking about contact, I am talking about knowing my name and circumstances at birth...That is a basic right that trumps other peoiple(IMO) rights in this whole thing.

The thing is that there are many adoptees that don't want contact so your worry about the adoptee hurting your other children may be a moot point...BUT they may still want a name...it is basic...

I may not want contact with other family members, they may hurt my current family but I still want my history...it is mine given to me by the mere fact that 2 people creating me no matter the circumstanses. I am physically here folks, and are desrving of knowing that biology that makes up myself and in part MY children.

I have been on these forums for years now and it never ceases to amaze me how it continue to be about the parents and not the kids?adults of the parents.

[rainbowfromgod]

You sound very angry. As an adoptee, I know who my real parents and family are. The ones who provided a loving home to me. My biological (birth) mother gave me life, but she is not my real family. Did she have other children? I understand she did. Would I like to meet them? I am not sure.

I gave my son up for adoption. I relinquished my rights. He has a family, who I pray gave him a loving and nurturing home, which is something I couldn't give him at the time of his birth. I had plenty of love, but not the capabilities.

My children know who their grandparents are. They also know I was a gift from God to my parents. You see they couldn't have children themselves, so God provided one for them.

[snuffie]

I agree that our families are our adoptive parents. I am a reunited adoptee and my birthfamily is also my family.

Both of my adoptive parents passed away some years ago. They were the ones who loved me, cared for me and were always there for me.

My birthfamily has the same genes, the same idiocyncrasies and quirks. We have very similar personalities and I know that they too are "there" for me and love me.

As an adoptee I feel truly blessed to have had so many people in my life who truly care for me on all sides of the triad. What a shame it would have been had there been no way of finding my birthfamily.

I realize that not everyone has the same experience as I have. But I also think that everyone should have the opportunity to find their family. I don't think the courts or others have the right to decide for us. Do we need protection from finding out who we are? Do our birthfamilies need protection from us? I think not.

I nearly died two months ago. Do I have less right to my health information than someone who was not adopted?

Snuffie

[fauxgina]

Interesting thread, snuffie. It's angering as an adoptee, because I agree wholeheartedly with you and nicole and dpen. That's not to say I can't see where people like rainbow and jeanette are coming from (I don't think both biological parents should have to give permission for the adoptee to find out basic info about him- or herself--it's not an abortion. In fact, isn't that the point?). I appreciate that birth parents are forced to move on with their lives, and perhaps they are ashamed of their decision and don't tell anyone else after relinquishing what has happened; they may very well want to protect the "normal" life they've managed to put together after such a devastating separation...

But. Birth parents were adults at the time of relinquishment, or at least they were the only ones, between them and the adoptee, who had any kind of choice (in most cases) to relinquish. The baby had no choice, no say, and to deny that child vital information about their history once he or she is grown and looking for answers is a practice in cruelty. Not intentional cruelty, per se, but it doesn't feel any better when it's intended to protect than it is when it's intended to harm. I am lucky in that I have my birthmother's name (at least, I can hope it's her real one), and although I don't have much more information, that name is something I cling to fiercely, even though I have no intention of searching yet. It would be incredible to have more information, but if I couldn't get it because the same birth parents who gave me up decided that they didn't want to be bothered later in life, no matter how good their reasons might be, I would be devastated. What's even more devastating is that lawmakers agree with that logic. It adds another layer of shame, anger, and frustration to the search for an adoptee's family, when it's hard enough when it all goes smoothly!

I usually stay out of discussions like this because they can quickly turn nasty and defensive, but I had to put in my two cents. Great points brought up so far, by everyone. I especially liked dpen's thought that the only thing that neither party has a total right to is contact. Total information yes, total contact no.

[dpen6]

Originally Posted by rainbowfromgod

You sound very angry. As an adoptee, I know who my real parents and family are. The ones who provided a loving home to me. My biological (birth) mother gave me life, but she is not my real family. Did she have other children? I understand she did. Would I like to meet them? I am not sure.

I gave my son up for adoption. I relinquished my rights. He has a family, who I pray gave him a loving and nurturing home, which is something I couldn't give him at the time of his birth. I had plenty of love, but not the capabilities.

My children know who their grandparents are. They also know I was a gift from God to my parents. You see they couldn't have children themselves, so God provided one for them.

I am NOT angry at being adopted, I AM angry at people telling me how or what I need or want. The implication that I don't feel my adoptive family is "real" is absurd. That has nothing to do with the fact that I am entitled to my own info as are my children.

you said you would only give location and circumstanses of birth to the one that really has no medical or social history on themselves and are suppose to just deal with that for the sake of everyone else that DOES have that most basic of info. Why?? Because for the one that was removed from their biological infomation MAY cause some discomfort for others not even invovled in the situation. Meaning other kids and spouses...my need for the basic info that everyone else in the world just takes for granted is dismissed as not important. The implication that the adoptee could hurt others just because they exist(though no fault of their own) is degrading. The faact that my children need for medical knowledge is dismissed and your raised kids potential for discomfort comes first is really degrading. Maybe you are an adoptee but your attiudes now are one of a birth mother.

Like I have siad since day one...it is NOT about contact or relationships that is a whole different issue and can of worms, it is about asssuring that the one that is lacking in knowledge, basic knowledge that can effect their lives and the lives of furture generations, is contunally dismissed and is not given the same amount of consideration in the whole adoption issue.

I am 50 years old, mother of 5 and live a decent life. It is very much the truth that I am/was able to live this life because of my parents(no describer needed), They are my siblings(again no describer needed) ARE my family..warts and all. BUT that does not change the fact that I was adopted, was given birth by another and have a whole history aout there that others just accept as theirs.... IMO..there is NO reason for me NOT knowing MY info, my history and my name at birth..just to protect others (both birth and adopted families) It is so dismissive of the one most impacted by adoption..the one given up and recived by other parents.

Whatever the reason for my adoption, whether I should be grateful or not(there are some adoptees that have had aweful lives BECAUSE of adoption) , I should have access to my name at birth. I should have updated medical info(I want to protect my children too), also social, and geneological history . Giving that info to me is NOT hurtful to anyone else.

What comes after the info is giving is up to the people involved. NOBODY want to deal with stalkers, nobody wants to be pushed into a relationship they are not ready for. That needs to be respected by all parties. Both birthfamilies and adoptees. It seems it is always the adoptee that is protrayed as the needy, neurotic peg in this triad . Their is an assumption that they are looking for family....I am not, I have family, I am looking for MY INFORMATION. There is an assumption that adoptive famlies, birthfamilies,both fathers, mothers ...and oh ya there raised children, and there parents and everyone else needs to be protected from the adoptee.....All I want is unrestricted information about my biology, so I can pass it to my kids....I may not want contact with my birthfather...I may need to protect my children from him and his family..but I still want that infoo..I truly feel I deserve and am entitled to it just by the mere fact I was created by these people....

Opening up records is a completly seperate issue from contact and realtionships.

Open records should just be a given for the person whose info is sealed....relationships are not, that has to be worked out by the parties involved.

But to not give the info because it might emotionally hurt someone, even with no contact is self serving to the person withholding the info.....and is making the person not able to get THEIR OWN information dismissed and unimportant in the whole situation.

[Sherr34]

Does this mean I cant get my Non Id information that I just sent off for. I am an adult adoptee. I am an adult I should be entitled to my Non ID Information

[snuffie]

As far as I know Wisconsin has not changed their laws. You are still able to obtain non-ID and there is also the adoption search agency to help you with a search.

[Sherr34]

Thank you. I just sent off for my Non Id. I was born 4/16/1973 at Elmbrook Memorial Hospital. Dr Mark J Popp I know the Social workers name that my adopted mother gave me and that is Joan Burmeister and I also know that I am 1/2 Norwegian.

[rainbowfromgod]

When I put my son up for adoption, his father and I both filled out medical information papers as a part of the adoption. This way his adoptive parents would have this and could pass it on to him as he became an adult. Unfortunately, there was not a whole lot I could provide since I don't have this information on myself. My parents never got this kind of information from my birth parents.

My birth mother was 16, obese, and scared. She had never told her mother she was pregnant. Her mother found out when she gave birth to me in the toilet. This is the only information I have on her.

The children I had later in life, as well as myself, have had to learn about any medical problems as they came up except those in their father's family. My son is looking at a bone transplant in his knee. They are not sure if this is a genetic problem or not. We probably will never know. However, my grandchild will have gained the knowledge. This is the most I can hope for.

I understand the frustation of not knowing. It is also frustrating to have the knowledge I do have about my birth mother and still not be able to get any other information. I tried to get some medical history when I got pregnant, but it was a futile search. I wanted to be able to provide this for the adopting parents, but it was not to be.